The top 10%?

I imagine this will sound like sour grapes (but hey doesn’t the whole blog anyway). I wasn’t in the top 10%; didn’t even break the top 25%. I will say in my defense, I wasn’t trying to be for many and various unrelated reasons. Everyone in law school has heard that you need to kill yourself to be in the top 10%. You see the summer internships which require top 25% standing or higher… You want to be Order of the Coif so badly you can taste it (I had never even heard of this until graduation day when everyone started asking why some people were wearing dots on their hat). Does it help? Sure. Can’t hurt. But herein is the interesting side of it as well, and while I am sure it doesn’t apply to everyone, it’s strange how often it does apply.

At one point in law school I was dating someone who was an attorney at one of the largest and most profitable law firms in the US. Over dinner one night I made a comment about how I wasn’t in the top 10% and they laughed and said don’t worry, you don’t want to be. They told me that their firm likes to emblazon on their propaganda that they only hire the best of the best and that 99% of their new hires  were in the top 10% of their graduating class etc. etc., but what they don’t put on their pamphlets is that they don’t keep them. They hire them and either they quit before a year is up, or the firm lets them go. They told me the average time the top 10-ers last is 9 months. Their particular office had, in the many years they had worked there, kept only 2 new hires in the top 10. EVERYONE ELSE WAS A LATERAL (much much more on this in later posts).

This seemed like the opposite of everything I was being told in law school. They then told me that basically it boils down to this, a lot of the same people who excel academically are unable to use that knowledge and ability to spew back a professor’s inanities into a beneficial job skill. Professors in my law school (particularly some of the bigger tools in that toolbox) liked saying that they weren’t teaching us to be lawyers or pass the bar… they were teaching us to think like lawyers.

One of the main things this attorney told me was that many times the very top people in the class are effectively socially retarded. Think aspergers… gifted academically but not so much socially. And the legal profession is first and foremost a service industry in which you need social skills. I thought about the top person in my class and it fit. They were a freak and a half and walked through the world with no concept at all of what was socially acceptable. So was #2… and I started trying to think of where the dividing line ran in my class for where the normal people started. It was an interesting thought experiment.

To illustrate the point, They told me a story of a top 10-er in their office. This guy had been hired from a summer position to be an associate. Great academics and all the right stuff on the resume, but he was a bit odd. Anyway, his work was acceptable and they could give him projects and they would be submitted at the deadline as needed. Apparently people started seeing him less and less at the office, but the work continued to be done so he was soon forgotten. Eventually a custodial worker in the office approached a partner and said they had an issue which needed attention. The custodian requested that the associate in question stop defecating into his office garbage can. (read that sentence again…) The partner was obviously very concerned and went down to the associate’s office, to find that the associate had moved into his office and basically, had not left the room in many many days. The associate had a mental breakdown a couple weeks prior and no one had noticed. The EMTs actually had to forcibly restrain him to get him out of his office.

One of the other great things to take away from this story is that this large law office cared so little for their associates that one of them could go insane and as long as the work was still done, they didn’t care.

 

minor update : Interesting read slightly related to this post over at Above the Law, The Best and Brightest 11/28/12

News: The Perils of Law School / Campos interview

Whenever a noteworthy article appears, I’ll drop a link and brief description. I’m working through the backlog of links I have so I’ll probably do a link dump in a day or so of numerous past articles. 

9/24/12 – Daily Beast – The Perils of Law School – brief interview with Paul Campos, similarly situated attorney who has been calling out Law Schools on his blog for what they are… a scam and pyramid scheme. (Inside the Law School Scam)

 

Interview Stories #1

I’ll be posting some of the sordid details of interviews I’ve had. As with everything, I won’t be naming names. And I can guess that even if someone associated with the firm / office I had been applying were to read this, they wouldn’t want to admit it was them considering why I am posting the stories.

I’m always excited to go to an interview. An interview means that you have made it to the next level.. that much closer to a real job. It means that out of the myriad applications and resumes they received, yours was picked out because something stood out about it.

I was headed out to an interview with a firm which specialized in Class Action and employment law. The firm had a few small regional offices, but a decent seeming cash flow considering several recent cases prominently on their website. Their main office was in a nice building downtown. I get to their office and a minor alarm bell goes off far in the recesses of my brain… it seems rather sparse. And there is no sign of support staff working there, which is weird because it is the middle of the week. But they do have other offices, and supposedly they usually work at one of them on this day. I did email back and forth with a secretary somewhere about the interview…

Anyway, I sit down with the two partners. The interview starts out rather normally, but about 5 min in, one of the partners apologizes and says he has to move his car so it won’t be ticketed. (He never returns.) The remaining partner starts talking to me about my past employment, specifically about the contract work I had done. He says he is unfamiliar with how it works (huh? they do class actions… they must use doc review… at least somewhat). I humor him and start explaining what I did for which employers. He starts getting more interested in certain aspects, and this part of the interview has been going on for probably 15+ minutes. He then asks how I was paid… for all of the contract employers, and about overtime, and about how many contract attorneys were working for the various firms.

He gets real excited when he learns that one firm didn’t give overtime to the contract attorneys. About the same time I figure it out, he offers to file an employment lawsuit on my behalf that could be a class action for everyone else who was working with me. 120 attorneys over 4 months. And then he just sits there waiting.

The rest of the interview was pretty fast. He gave me his card and said if I wanted to file or if I knew anyone else who did, to give him a call; and oh yeah, they’d get back to me about the ‘position’. As I was walking out, another young attorney was walking in to be ‘interviewed’. I wouldn’t even bother betting that he had a resume with contract work listed on it.

I went to an interview that was actually a ploy trawling for work.

Why your internship is worthless…

The first handful of days I’m probably going to make a ton of posts. Just so I can write out my experiences thus far that keep bouncing around in my brain.

Due to a rather ridiculous recent email exchange I had with a potential employer I figured I would start with this.

Your internship is worthless.

Don’t get me wrong, if you happen to be a summer associate and are offered a job this is not directed at you precisely, but it is still good to know in case you leave your job, or as happened to me and many people in my class and those before me — the job offers were rescinded.

Most reputable law schools will tell their students that an internship is absolutely necessary. If you happen to be in the 3rd / 4th tier as some of my friends were, it seems that what little career guidance you get is mostly garnered from fellow students, but the gist is the same. To be competitive in the job market, you need to have been involved with a substantive internship.

In the past, most internships were paid. Legal interns (or as many offices call them: Law Clerks) do the job of an actual attorney and are theoretically overseen by a senior attorney at the office. I say theoretically because most everyone I know was involved in a free-range internship with the concept that you would either pick it up or you wouldn’t, but no one was going to go out of their way to teach you because they had their own work to do. The work product you do is reviewed by the senior attorney and then they sign their name and number to it. In previous years, if an intern was brought on for the summer and their work was good, they were offered a job once they got out of law school. You could look forward to starting at low pay with a big bump once you passed the bar exam and were admitted.

I am not sure when this stopped. It stopped quite a while ago from what I understand. These days you are considered incredibly lucky if your internship is paid. In effect, you put in your time for free and often pay (in some way – parking, gas, etc) a decent amount to volunteer for the benefit of ‘learning the ropes’ of becoming an attorney in whatever niche field you are interning. Law firms and government law offices know that they can get free labor, and therefore don’t need to hire someone to do extra legal paperwork… instead they just ‘hire’ an intern.

 NPR – Unpaid Interns ; USAToday – The Blurry line between the unpaid internship and free labor ; Atlantic – Why free internships are immoral ; NYT – The unpaid intern, legal or not

National Law Review – Unpaid internships ; Poynter – internship vs abuse

It isn’t hard to find things written about it online. When times get bad is when internships are abused the most. Law firms laid off associates and they picked up free interns to pick up some of the slack. Government offices have freezes or RiF and suddenly you will start seeing the unpaid interns walking the halls. A lot is said about Labor standards in previous links, but most interns can’t afford to enforce these because you will essentially be blacklisted (your local legal community is smaller than you think). And potential interns can’t afford to pass up an internship because as previously stated… everyone in law school has already told you ‘to be competitive in the job market, you need to have an internship on your resume.’

So… basically most law students are told to get an internship anyway possible, paid or not. Here’s where the real catch comes though. Once you graduate and pass the bar, your internship experience amounts to nothing. Employers specifically state that only post JD experience is applicable, even if they don’t explicitly state it — your experience will be dismissed regardless of what you did. I’ve been in interviews where I start off talking about my experience in a particular legal field and the interviewer interrupts me and said, “but not significantly post JD…” Check any federal job listing on USAJobs. It stipulates strictly post-JD experience only counts.

So what was the point of working at an internship and taking on an extra workload concurrent with your studies for your 2 eligible internship years in law school? (for those not yet in massive crushing debt law school, the ABA sets guidelines stating that during your first year you are not eligible for internships, and it highly suggests law students do not hold any job during their first year.)

I would love to know what 2 years at an internship has gotten me that counts for something.

Another one…

I had considered starting this ‘gripe’ blog for quite awhile. I kept hoping against hope to actually find a real job and negate my growing desire to add my voice to the chorus online of other similarly situated attorneys. But after a year and a half of looking in earnest I’ve come to an unfortunate realization. Going to law school was one of the biggest mistakes I have ever made.

Don’t get me wrong; it was intellectually stimulating, and at times fun, but in terms of a career there really isn’t a worse choice I could have made. I’ll be explaining why thru posts on here. As the title implies, Law Schools are lying to the general populace about the potential for careers and the salary to be expected. For several years now there has been a growing groundswell for the ABA to more thoroughly regulate Law School statistics released to the public. I’d personally like the ABA to actually regulate law schools significantly more than the minimum they do now; and start revoking certification to the well known offenders dragging down legal education (we all know who they are… and more on this later).

Truly this is catharsis. And cheaper than therapy; especially since without a job I have no insurance. I will post my stories of meandering through the legal field, and pretty much anything else vaguely related. So until I can figure out what my ESQ is good for, welcome to the blog lonely traveler.

Law School – A very expensive mistake….